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Diplomaticcorp Discussion Forum:  Winter Blitz

(4th Annual DC Winter Blitz (WB 2011))


Post:< 24727 
Subject:< DC 444 Italy EoG >
Topic:Winter Blitz >
Category:< Active Games >
Author:Koensig
Posted:Apr 03, 2013 at 1:04 pm
Viewed:788 times

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p { margin: 0; }My first thought is a
thank you to Jerome as well. This game was a little bit weird so thank you for
putting up with us. 
 
It was a very unusual
game for me as well. I have been playing diplomacy for a while now but this was
the first time I had ever played as Russia in a serious game.
 
In the very beginning John
approached me with the idea of the ARF alliance and I was very willing??? it
offered me an easy chance to take out Turkey. In the back of my mind however
was always the possibility of stabbing him. Then Stuart leaked his email, which
changed our alliance from ARF to AIR which worried me even more. A powerful
Austria always has the ability to stab Italy in the back.
 
The alliance ended in
that terrible six way draw. At that point I decided to switch my allegiance to
Germany and France. I had maintained a good relationship with Hugh all through
the game and so was comfortable allying with him to break the stalemate.
Unfortunately, along the way I had some idiotic NMRs that screwed up my stab.
 
All in all, it was a fun
game and I look forward to playing with you guys again.
 
Good luck in the second
round,
 
Scott From: "Eric Marr" <ericmarr(at)gmail.com>
To: "John R" <untitled36(at)hotmail.com>, "Hugh Polley" <hapolley(at)yahoo.ca>, "Jerome Payne" <jeromerpayne(at)gmail.com>, "wb 2 2010 turkey" <hurup(at)pc.dk>, "wb11 2 austria" <johnston.scott(at)comcast.net>, "Stuart Winch" <stuartandmaria(at)googlemail.com>, "Danilo Bliek" <danilobliekthebest(at)hotmail.com>, "WB 2011 england 1" <jerome777(at)ymail.com>, blitz(at)diplomaticcorp.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 3, 2013 10:13:45 AM
Subject: DC 444 Italy EoG

I too would like to thank Jerome for a very well-run game. Especially
in the last few years with all the EOG proposals and the banter
between seasons.

From my perspective this was a very unusual game where I switched
sides multiple times never really knowing who I should work with. I
have been a member of Diplomaticcorp for a long time but I have been
away from diplomacy for a few years so everyone in this game was new
to me. I also started a bit rusty but my first assumption was that, as
Italy, moving East made more sense than moving West. In fact, my first
set of moves had me moving to Tri in s01. However, once I got talking
to people I found that Austria was more talkative, and suited my style
of play better than France and he convinced me to come on side with a
AIR alliance. I was highly suspect of the idea and regularly
questioned what would happen once Turkey was eliminated, without ever
really getting a good answer. But given the positions of other players
and my lack of a relationship with France, I decided to go along with
it and changed my moves at the last minute. My plan was to move West
while A/R moved East and hopefully make gains in France with
Germany/England faster than Turkey was eliminated and then be able to
turn my attentions back once I was double-crossed. This was why I
never helped eliminate Turkey. I did not want him to be eliminated and
I did not realistically think I could hold any gains from him.

Well, of course that all fell apart pretty fast. I had a really hard
time working with Germany and we never seemed to be on the same page
when it came to moves or diplomacy. He regularly made moves I thought
were strange and most of our discussions turned to arguments. I think
I eventually asked you to stop emailing me because I was so annoyed.
Sorry about that.

Then there was the infamous email that I was unintentionally cc???d on.
At first I wasn???t sure whether to take it seriously or whether it was
counter-intelligence. In the end I decided that if it were genuine I
needed to take action on it right away. I forwarded it to the other
players and we made a short-lived plan to work together. I asked them
to keep it quiet since I never saw a follow up and hoped that maybe no
one noticed me on the list of recipients. Once, again, this all fell
apart pretty fast. I was particularly annoyed that Germany shared our
plans in the press (although I guess it didn???t matter since everyone
already knew).

At this point I was pretty torn. I had moved a bit towards Austria but
I was still in no real position to attack him alone. I didn???t know
whether Germany was onside with our counter-alliance and since he had
been irritating me through diplomacy and the press I decided to take
my chances with Austria. After all, he was very convincing and I
enjoyed talking to him.

From that point you guys know the rest. I basically stopped talking to
anyone else and we just coordinated our moves through the stalemate.
The French NMR was a big gain for us, but at that point I didn???t
really care and just wanted the game to end.

I am very happy with the end, even though the lead up was very odd and
non-linear.

Thanks to all of you for the game and especially to John for being a
great ally and to Jerome for being a great GM.

Good luck in your second rounds. I hope to see you in another game
sometime soon.

Eric


On Wed, Apr 3, 2013 at 11:41 AM, John R <untitled36(at)hotmail.com> wrote:
> First, let me start off by saying I feel like I don't really deserve the
> draw in one sense. My diplomacy was poor this game. My apologies for not
> talking more to everyone. I feel like I played a solid tactical game, and
> developed a solid trust with Italy, and those two things saved me.
>
> Here's the game as I saw it:
>
> I've played on Diplomaticcorp for some time now, and you get to know repeat
> players. I had worked relatively well with the French and Russian players in
> the past, while the Turkish player and I had previously had an adversarial
> relationship. I was super busy at work, and didn't have time to do the right
> thing and get to know everyone else, and start with a fresh slate, so I
> defaulted to trying to do the "easy" thing and hit up France and Russia for
> a FAR triple (triples are *the* way to do well in the blitz, mark my
> words!). It looked like it could really work well, but France made the
> mistake of copying our whole email exchange to Italy.
>
> I think Hugh commented at one point that the FAR didn't even realize what
> they had done, but that wasn't true. I scolded France immediately after he
> sent it (I was CC'ed on that fateful email and immediately realized what had
> occurred). But we felt it was better to play it cool and hope Italy hadn't
> read the whole email chain. Unfortunately, Eric had indeed read the email
> top to bottom. So we had to scramble to figure out what to do.
>
> While I wanted the FAR to be my primary alliance, I was also trying to lure
> Italy into an AIR alliance to take out turkey, which would let me fight on
> one front at a time. After the email issue, I cut france out, and tried my
> hardest to convince Italy that my true loyalty lay with the AIR. And indeed,
> I was telling the truth. France's breach of trust made me leery to try
> something as complex as a triple alliance with him any further. Eric was
> initially very hesitant, and understandably so. But eventually I proved my
> trustworthiness.
>
> By this point, poor turkey really hadn't had a chance. Italy hadn't
> initially joined in the slaughter, but I'd convinced him to at least stay
> away, so Russia and I carved us some turkey. And that growth led to a strong
> AIR that looked to sweep the board. My memories at this next juncture are a
> bit fuzzy, but we ended up with the 6 way stalemate monstrosity that almost
> everyone hated. The rest of the game is straightforward, really the only
> hanging thread is why Russia stabbed me during endgame. It seems pretty
> goofy to me, especially since I hadn't made a single move against Russia the
> entire game until that final stab.
>
> Eric (Italy) was a pleasure to work with. I wish we had started working
> together better sooner. But the end result left us as participants in a
> draw. Great job man.
>
> Hugh probably did more than anyone to force the end of the game by
> convincing the non-winning powers to get on board, so in a sense the draw is
> his doing more so than necessarily Eric, France, or me. I appreciate the
> assist, hugh.
>
> Thanks to our GM for keeping us on track. Especially handling up to 6 draw
> proposals per turn. That's the hardest thing about GMing for me, keeping
> track of who voted what on multiple draws. So kudos to him! A well run game!
>
> John
>
>
> ________________________________

This message is in reply to post 24726:

I too would like to thank Jerome for a very well-run game. Especially
in the last few years with all the EOG proposals and the banter
between seasons.
From my perspective this was a very unusual game where I switched
sides multiple times never really knowing who I should work with. I
have been a member of Diplomaticcorp for a long time but I have been
away from diplomacy for a few years so everyone in this game was new
to me. I also started a bit rusty but my first assumption was that, as
Italy, moving East made more sense than moving West. In fact, my first
set of moves had me moving to Tri in s01. However, once I got talking
to people I found that Austria was more talkative, and suited my style
of play better than France and he convinced me to come on side with a
AIR alliance. I was highly suspect of the idea and regularly
questioned what would happen once Turkey was eliminated, without ever
really getting a good answer. But given the positions of other players
and my lack of a relationship with France, I decided to go along with
it and changed my moves at the last minute. My plan was to move West
while A/R moved East and hopefully make gains in France with
Germany/England faster than Turkey was eliminated and then be able to
turn my attentions back once I was double-crossed. This was why I
never helped eliminate Turkey. I did not want him to be eliminated and
I did not realistically think I could hold any gains from him.
Well, of course that all fell apart pretty fast. I had a really hard
time working with Germany and we never seemed to be on the same page
when it came to moves or diplomacy. He regularly made moves I thought
were strange and most of our discussions turned to arguments. I think
I eventually asked you to stop emailing me because I was so annoyed.
Sorry about that.
Then there was the infamous email that I was unintentionally cc'd on.
At first I wasn't sure whether to take it seriously or whether it was
counter-intelligence. In the end I decided that if it were genuine I
needed to take action on it right away. I forwarded it to the other
players and we made a short-lived plan to work together. I asked them
to keep it quiet since I never saw a follow up and hoped that maybe no
one noticed me on the list of recipients. Once, again, this all fell
apart pretty fast. I was particularly annoyed that Germany shared our
plans in the press (although I guess it didn't matter since everyone
already knew).
At this point I was pretty torn. I had moved a bit towards Austria but
I was still in no real position to attack him alone. I didn't know
whether Germany was onside with our counter-alliance and since he had
been irritating me through diplomacy and the press I decided to take
my chances with Austria. After all, he was very convincing and I
enjoyed talking to him.
From that point you guys know the rest. I basically stopped talking to
anyone else and we just coordinated our moves through the stalemate.
The French NMR was a big gain for us, but at that point I didn't
really care and just wanted the game to end.
I am very happy with the end, even though the lead up was very odd and
non-linear.
Thanks to all of you for the game and especially to John for being a
great ally and to Jerome for being a great GM.
Good luck in your second rounds. I hope to see you in another game
sometime soon.
Eric

On Wed, Apr 3, 2013 at 11:41 AM, John R wrote:
First, let me start off by saying I feel like I don't really deserve the
draw in one sense. My diplomacy was poor this game. My apologies for not
talking more to everyone. I feel like I played a solid tactical game, and
developed a solid trust with Italy, and those two things saved me.

Here's the game as I saw it:

I've played on Diplomaticcorp for some time now, and you get to know repeat
players. I had worked relatively well with the French and Russian players in
the past, while the Turkish player and I had previously had an adversarial
relationship. I was super busy at work, and didn't have time to do the right
thing and get to know everyone else, and start with a fresh slate, so I
defaulted to trying to do the "easy" thing and hit up France and Russia for
a FAR triple (triples are *the* way to do well in the blitz, mark my
words!). It looked like it could really work well, but France made the
mistake of copying our whole email exchange to Italy.

I think Hugh commented at one point that the FAR didn't even realize what
they had done, but that wasn't true. I scolded France immediately after he
sent it (I was CC'ed on that fateful email and immediately realized what had
occurred). But we felt it was better to play it cool and hope Italy hadn't
read the whole email chain. Unfortunately, Eric had indeed read the email
top to bottom. So we had to scramble to figure out what to do.

While I wanted the FAR to be my primary alliance, I was also trying to lure
Italy into an AIR alliance to take out turkey, which would let me fight on
one front at a time. After the email issue, I cut france out, and tried my
hardest to convince Italy that my true loyalty lay with the AIR. And indeed,
I was telling the truth. France's breach of trust made me leery to try
something as complex as a triple alliance with him any further. Eric was
initially very hesitant, and understandably so. But eventually I proved my
trustworthiness.

By this point, poor turkey really hadn't had a chance. Italy hadn't
initially joined in the slaughter, but I'd convinced him to at least stay
away, so Russia and I carved us some turkey. And that growth led to a strong
AIR that looked to sweep the board. My memories at this next juncture are a
bit fuzzy, but we ended up with the 6 way stalemate monstrosity that almost
everyone hated. The rest of the game is straightforward, really the only
hanging thread is why Russia stabbed me during endgame. It seems pretty
goofy to me, especially since I hadn't made a single move against Russia the
entire game until that final stab.

Eric (Italy) was a pleasure to work with. I wish we had started working
together better sooner. But the end result left us as participants in a
draw. Great job man.

Hugh probably did more than anyone to force the end of the game by
convincing the non-winning powers to get on board, so in a sense the draw is
his doing more so than necessarily Eric, France, or me. I appreciate the
assist, hugh.

Thanks to our GM for keeping us on track. Especially handling up to 6 draw
proposals per turn. That's the hardest thing about GMing for me, keeping
track of who voted what on multiple draws. So kudos to him! A well run game!

John


________________________________
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 16:12:08 -0700
From: hapolley(at)yahoo.ca
Subject: Re: dc444 German End Game!
To: jeromerpayne(at)gmail.com; hurup(at)pc.dk; Johnston.scott(at)comcast.net;
untitled36(at)hotmail.com; stuartandmaria(at)googlemail.com; ericmarr(at)gmail.com;
danilobliekthebest(at)hotmail.com; jerome777(at)ymail.com;
blitz(at)diplomaticcorp.com

German End Game Statement:

A great group of players! I have the suspicion the group is a mixture of
experienced and newer players. As Germany I have not had much luck when
allying with England so at start of game I decided he would be the target of
my diplomatic efforts.

An email circulated by Italy indicating a R/A/F alliance resulted in my
worrying about what Stuart might do and I stood of on Burgundy instead of
making a better move. To that extent the forwarded email had some affect.
A breakthrough occurred when France agreed to convoy my army Belgium to
Wales and Russia agreed to trade Sweden for Norway. Now it took to long to
set this all up giving Austria and Italy time to grow to point where they
could strike at F/G. Still if Russia had not joined in attack the game might
have ended differently. The other deciding factor was R/I/A ganging up on
Turkey, this left no country counter weight to I/A/R plans.

Facing elimination after convoy to Wales, England agreed to abandon England
in return for survival position in Norway and StP. He did not keep exact
deal, on one occasion retreating to SKA, and in another not voting for F/A
draw and attacking my SC in Norway threatening to occupy North Sea. Still
his actions enabled F/G to establish a solid stalemate line.

If it had not been for key NMR by France because of GM communication to
Germany error, game could have ended in F/A tie. Still Game Mastering is no
easy task and each must do it in his or her own way. Except for Eric my
communications with all players were excellent. My teasing of Eric to get
him to attack France worked; but too well. Still it prevented France from
joining an A/R/F alliance. I finished with 5 SC including Munich, that is
better than being eliminated.

With Warm Regards!
Hugh - hapolley(at)yahoo.ca

There are 2 Messages in this Thread:


DC 444 Italy EoG (ericjmarr) Apr 03, 12:13 pm

DC 444 Italy EoG (Koensig) Apr 03, 01:04 pm

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